Unity 5 is out, and it's free with pro features!

Monkey Archive Forums/Digital Discussion/Unity 5 is out, and it's free with pro features!

Xaron(Posted 2015) [#1]
Nothing more to add. Finally a reaction to Epic's Unreal Engine.

AdamRedwoods(Posted 2015) [#2]
Pretty cool.
The only thing I really like is how it's a visual layout tool. I'm not so jazzed about the language, and I don't need all the cutting edge tech.

ElectricBoogaloo(Posted 2015) [#3]
I've installed it, and am getting ready to give it a whirl.
My findings will be mostly posted here.
As the sort of dev that's been (very much) a BRL-For-Life kind of guy, it's probably going to be a long road ahead.
.. I'm already tearing my hair out, and I've not even started!!!

bazmonkey(Posted 2015) [#4]
@ElectricBoogaloo it took me a while to really 'get' how Unity wants you to work. I'd recommend going through Ray Wenderlich's unity tutorials (his site has them for 2d and 3d).

ElectricBoogaloo(Posted 2015) [#5]
Thanks, I'll look into them.
Currently staring at what is essentially a GUI with a 3D scene in the middle, and wondering where the code bit's supposed to be!

psst.. Mark... Don't EVER change TED!!!!! *hugs TED for comfort*

bazmonkey(Posted 2015) [#6]
You will love it... soon. Keep going. Once you've started re-using scripts by just dragging them onto items in the scene you will see how powerful it is.

Actually, where to put scripts is one of the key things. If its moving an enemy, put it on the enemy. If it moves the Camera, put it there. The only issue I had was where to put 'main' game logic. You can get away with hanging it on the Player or Camera even, but afaik a separate GameObject controller thing is the accepted choice [someone will correct me...].

Raul(Posted 2015) [#7]
You can create an empty game object "_MainLoop" and code your logic there.

Anyway, there are situations where you do not need this Main Loop. I saw a lot of tutorials and samples and there was no need for this. It's hard for beginners but soon you will love it!!


ElectricBoogaloo(Posted 2015) [#8]
Yeah, Having started reading those tutorials, I'm starting to formulate the best way to achieve a more blitz-like structure.
Having a large Game Manager object seems to be the best way forward. I'll be experimenting with that, and seeing how well it works out.

Shocked to learn that, even with such a huge, sprawling IDE, the actual code loads up inside a different bloomin' app!! MonoDevelop loads up any time you try to edit the code.
What on EARTH is that about!!??
Why make such a big IDE/GUI, but leave out the actual important bit?

.. Again.. Mark.. Don't EVER change TED!!!!

'Tis silly!!

Raul(Posted 2015) [#9]
you can use Visual Studio if you do not like Mono Dev. (i know this was not your question), just wanted to inform.
I think they decided to use a 3rd party tool in order to not work on an editor, too. :D

ElectricBoogaloo(Posted 2015) [#10]
It's not that I don't like monodev, more that I was expecting "UNITY", with it's great big IDE, to have at least "united" a text editor in there!!! Seems baffling that they haven't done that..

Sammy(Posted 2015) [#11]
Try the Godot engine, it has complete integration and a relatively tiny installation too. It's great.

ElectricBoogaloo(Posted 2015) [#12]
I'm struggling enough with the mountains of garbage I already have to deal with, without adding more on top, thanks!!!

FWIW : I think I've already given up with Unity. It's nice enough, but I don't think it's very suitable for AGameAWeek.

EdzUp(Posted 2015) [#13]
Im currently on Unity 4.6 and its much easier to use than the previous version I used ages ago that was 3.5. Will try Unity 5 next and see how easy that is to use :D

EdzUp(Posted 2015) [#14]
For me Unity 5 is so easy as I'm coming from Unity 4.6, I have my entire framework ported to c# under Unity and its as fast as monkey.

However I'm also still coding my c++/OpenGL and that's really moving forwards now, I have just added audio recording to the engine and I'm knee deep in the renderer at present. My aim is to have targets for Windows (x86/x64), Linux (x86/x64), OSX, Android and iOS.

Back OT Unity isn't for everyone but the results are the same as monkey if you just want to use 2d. If ya want 3d I would give it a whirl.

skape(Posted 2015) [#15]
but the results are the same as monkey if you just want to use 2d.

I don't agree. I found it impossible (or extremely difficult) to get 100% pixel perfect 2D rendering. There were always rendering errors of some sort where certain pixels were distorted, etc. (I had a really hard time getting a seamless tile system working too, and I've seen tons of Unity games that have wonky tiles with occasional gaps or stuttering.)

That was in 4.6, don't know about 5.

Amon(Posted 2015) [#16]

If not all 2D Games made with Unity suffered this then I would put the outcome down to the experience of the coder for said game.

EdzUp(Posted 2015) [#17]
5 seems ok at present :)

skape(Posted 2015) [#18]

I have seen "professional" big-ish budget games with these issues (especially the tile one, where seams briefly appear on occasion.) And search the Unity forums. There are oodles of people complaining about weird rendering artifacts when doing 2D, with few (if any) completely effective solutions.

At least, last time I tried it, which may have actually been 4.3...

But you are right, I couldn't be bothered to spend enough time with Unity to become an "expert." ;) Other solutions are cutting it for me at the moment.

EdzUp(Posted 2015) [#19]
Fwiw monkey has artifacts with sprite sheets and loadanimimage, you have to turn off mojo filtering to get rid of it.

None of that happened with max and below,my guess is mark is just changing the UVs for the positions instead of cutting out the images and using them.

Neuro(Posted 2015) [#20]
GoDot is actually quite nice - especially for a 20mb download. It even makes a blatant jab reference to Unity in their features page regarding 2D :).

dragon(Posted 2015) [#21]
hm, i did some (first!) tests with unity - only boxes and spheres...
no textures, no alpha - very simple

but i have some problems on my old android 2.3.3
no shadows and strange flickerings...

O_o ?

using "legacy vertex rendering" or "legacy shaders" fixed this
but it have no realtime shadows and simple shading...

next, i play with godot...

dragon(Posted 2015) [#22]
Unity: Shadows support

iPhone 4S or later
Android 4.0 or later

I testet Godot, Shadows works on my Android 2.3.3
(1st tablet from Samsung)

so i am surprised why here is so big issue for Unity with such big dev team - compared to Godot

Xaron(Posted 2015) [#23]
Well tbh Android 2.3 is really a bit out of date. ;) I just think they don't support such old stuff anymore.

Derron(Posted 2015) [#24]
Old stuff? My wifes android 2.3(.7) smartphone is just out of warranty (but even did not get no "major version"-updates within that time). This means that the device is now 26 months old ... I know this is a big timestep in "smartphone years". But for Windows that would mean: you only support Win 8.0 - and in 5 months your next major version just supports win8.1+.

I happily accept that you need to upgrade software from time to time ... but with "android devices" being the stepchild of the family regarding "available upgrades" for the major amount of devices ...you should keep requirements as low as possible. Especially if there is _no_ need to require a higher API level (I do not know if there is a need...).


Raul(Posted 2015) [#25]
2.x.x is so old that not even software companies which are making 'real' software are not supporting it.

as a game programmer trying to make a game for android 2.x.x or even 3.x.x is useless.

Derron(Posted 2015) [#26]
If you want to reach as much users as possible, you target as low as possible. Ask the messenger-developers of your choice what they think about "not supporting 2.3". Of course there will come a time with support fading out. But check out when XP support was dropped by applications (not games relying on DX).

Like said: if there is no need to use a higher api level, do not use it.


MikeHart(Posted 2015) [#27]
As of March, 2nd 2015, API 10 and 8 have a market share of 7.3% I think it is save to target higher API level!


Derron(Posted 2015) [#28]
7% is nothing to neglect ... imho. But of course it is up to individual decision. Like said: if there is no need to increase api level, you should try to avoid it.

Also the stats only count devices using the google play store - dunno how stats are for foreign markets like China with their "Pirate App Stores" (ok, you wont sell much to them :p).
And yes, the more months are gone, the lower the number will get - I am fully aware of this.

Edit: 7% of > devices is still not that low.


dragon(Posted 2015) [#29]
Well tbh Android 2.3 is really a bit out of date. ;) I just think they don't support such old stuff anymore.

2.3 ist not old
Unity works with android 2.3

2.x.x is so old that not even software companies which are making 'real' software are not supporting it.
as a game programmer trying to make a game for android 2.x.x or even 3.x.x is useless.


Shadow using Shadow Maps works on Android 2.3.3.
But not with Unity
Also years ago this was not possible...

Only with new hardware it is possible...

If you want to reach as much users as possible, you target as low as possible.

My Andoid 2.3.3 is very slow, it is good to test games on slow devices...
So my 3D test scene with shadow have 30 fps...
This should run like hell on new devices... :-)

Derron(Posted 2015) [#30]
So my 3D test scene with shadow have 30 fps...
This should run like hell on new devices... :-)

Not in all cases: older devices often had also lower screen resolution. Now you are talking about 3D, which scales well with the resolution you "demand" from the engine. Means on newer devices you might end up having FullHD-res or even bigger, compared to 2.3.7 typical 8*0x480 or 480x3*0.

So with the over 4 times bigger screens you need of course more pixel fill rate etc. The only thing which stays similar is the VRAM for textures/atlases.


Raul(Posted 2015) [#31]
I see your point, but i do not know any low cost android user with old phones paying for the games/apps. this is enough for me. and it seems for other developers. too.

Derron(Posted 2015) [#32]
There are people out there who offer free software. Or "ad-powered" software...
There might be software written for android which needs a high userbase to "work" (eg. messengers, community-tools). Sometimes it is not the tool generating the income, but the environment of the surrounding community (3rd party economy).

But accepted, it is _your_ opinion (same as above is mine...).


dragon(Posted 2015) [#33]
strange, in both: Unity and Godot, i was not able to raycast from screen to "click a object"
i tried this 1 day, but no luck

now i found out how to do this,

dragon(Posted 2015) [#34]
i updated my tab from android 2.3.3 to 4.4.4 (cyanogenmod)
and now unity works with shadows...

ElectricBoogaloo(Posted 2015) [#35]
For those interested.

I installed, and tried out Unity.
I gave it a good shot, and found the following two enhancements that I could achieve for my own particular style of game.
1. I could do kickass lighting and shadowing
2. I could use mod/xm music.

Other than these two things, I didn't really notice anything that I wasn't already achieving in Monkey-X, and since I was already comfortable with Monkey-X, I decided to end my journey with Unity there.

For me, it wasn't enough of an enhancement to warrant any further investigation.
I'm sticking with Monkey, because I'm comfortable with it, and for what I need, it's more than capable of achieving my goals.

This is, of course, a very personal choice. I'm sure other folk will look at Unity and see an entirely different beast. To those, I say go for it. It's "free", so there's no real harm in at least giving it a go.

Why0Why(Posted 2015) [#36]
My experience has been much like yours. I gave Unity 20 hours or so and came away impressed, but my projects are fairly simple 2D affairs and Monkey works for me!

EdzUp(Posted 2015) [#37]
If I was making a 3d game then unity would be ok there, for a 2d game like Star rogue (see sig) monkey is brilliant.

Xyle(Posted 2015) [#38]
I agree with EdzUp,

I just recently found out about Unity 5, got all cracked out in excitement and watched/ used a total of 38 tutorials over the course of 4 days.

In the end, I absolutely love it! But will only be using it for 3d games. The ability to make full fledged 3d scenes, objects and manipulate them all with c# scripts within the same IDE is phenomenal to a guy like me. It kind of reminds me of a Flash enviroment but for 3d stuff (create objects, manipulate them with actionscript).

Unity also game me the chance to experience C#, something I was always terrified of since my first C++ days 15 years ago. Found out how simple and easy to understand it really is.

MonkeyX will still be my goto for anything 2d due to already having all my enviroments setup and loving the language!

Salmakis(Posted 2015) [#39]
im forced to use it in my new Job now,
and i know why i never really liked it, all my expections (bad Performance, more workarounding then real coding,ppl just buy assets and hack them togheter) are come true in my new Company, and i know this happens in all of them.

My heard is bleeding when i see how they make 2d puzzles games wich Need like 30mb while the same stuff with monkey would be not even 2mb.

so is there any really good loking 3d game out made with unity?
i mean really looking good, kinda AAAish?

At all i wonder why there is a Unity thread in every Forum, fanboys spreading thery junk?
so now even in monkey-x where talking about unity now?

there is no better viral Marketing than having fanboys spamming about how cool unity is in all Forums related to gamedev or other languages/engines.
The result is that everybody uses Unity, and other projects wich have a nice approach aswell (like Monkey as example) cant grow.

just my Opinion about Unity

Sammy(Posted 2015) [#40]
Besiege -> http://store.steampowered.com/app/346010/
Sir, You Are Being Hunted -> http://store.steampowered.com/app/242880/?snr=1_7_15__13

Are both quite good looking Unity3D games IMHO.

EdzUp(Posted 2015) [#41]
Wasteland 2 is Unity as well

bazmonkey(Posted 2015) [#42]
Gone Home is Unity, as is Cities: Skylines ('heavily adapted engine').
But yes, the bloated builds are perhaps the biggest annoyance for small games.
Monkey and Unity are both great!

EDIT - I'd say Ziggurat (milkstone) is a great looking Unity game, even though its a small indie team.

taumel(Posted 2015) [#43]
There once was a 3d/gamedev tool named Workbench. Sadly the dev, nice guy, couldn't continue to further develop it.

I liked it for the name alone.