Saddened by the loss of HTML5
Community Forums/Monkey2 Talk/Saddened by the loss of HTML5
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| Please tell me that quick testing isn't going to be a slow donkey-trek in the absence of HTML5, that feature is handy due to the faster HTML5 build time. |
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| I think HTML5 should still be a target on Monkey2, perhaps keep HTML5 but support a framework such as Phaser? |
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| It seems build time for C++ target will be largely improved by a new modularized build system (also potentially by the usage of the LLVM based compiler) so I'm not sure we'll miss html5 compile time that much |
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| HTML5 + WebGL could still be added later, in my opinion. Data types like Byte, UByte, Word, UWord, Long, ULong, Integer, UInteger, Quad, UQuad, etc. could be added using wrapper classes. Problems would be pointers and stuff, if (and only if) MX2 supports it - so HTML5 target could be potentially limited. For the moment it looks like MX2 is more suitable for Desktop/Tablet/IoT programming by allowing more low-level features than MX. It's a required change to survive in a world with Haxe, QT, and Microsoft's new cross-platform stuff. |
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| HTML5 is still to young and incomplete for all things that monkey wants to do, there is even loads that it cannot do already. Why cripple a product to keep support across the board just so everyone can go 'yay I can run it in a browser' seems stupid IMHO. |
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| Some of us need browser support so that we don't get forced into buying a Mac to go cross platform. |
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| Going Desktop cross-platform is possible without buying a new Mac Mini for $499, by using Linux/Android. In the long-term cloud and browser support is a requirement anyway. One man just can't do all that alone and at once, so OpenSource is a good decision (and I agree with Mark that selling new closed-source programming languages is a no-go today). Every new programming languages stuff is cross-platform, OpenSource almost all of the time, and driven by more than 1 guy. Nearly everything targets Desktop + Mobile (Phone/Tablets) + the Web. The perfect language for everything has still to be found. Maybe it will be MX2. ;) ...and MX will still be there and useable - like BlitzMax today. |
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| I think it is a great decision to move to C++-only targets. HTML5 should be implemented using Emscripten. |
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| Danilo: Going Desktop cross-platform is possible without buying a new Mac Mini for $499, by using Linux/Android. How did you come to that conclusion?. From what I read, owning an Intel based Mac is a requirement when making games or apps for iOS and Mac. |
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| @Steve Ancell: Using Windows + HTML5 + Browser you can't do Apple AppStore Apps today. Of course you need (at least a cheap) Mac to create native Mac/iOS binaries, or you use a cloud-based service that provides a virtual Mac machine. It is one of the points that probably do not change between MX1 and MX2, unless Mark starts providing (paid) cloud compilation as a service. If you want to develop for Mac and/or iOS, you generally should own those devices. Yes, that's true. Additionally, you have to pay the annual Apple Developer Fee of $99 to release Apps to the AppStore - which has nothing to do with MX1 and MX2. An alternative would be using V-Play 2D Game Engine (using Qt). |
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| @Danilo: What I mean is browser based stuff is mine, and some other coders way of getting stuff played across platforms. The HTML5 and Flash target helps a lot. |
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| I made more Money selling html5 licenses than i did onvboth mobile platforms. I feel with you Steve. |
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| Dropping HTML5 is a good move. Remember how Mojo originally didn't support SetColor for tinting images and Mark had to add a dirty hack after people complained? And how Monkey didn't have threading support because Javascript and Flash don't support it? That's why it should go. |
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| ... and it's worth bearing in mind that we already have HTML5 in Monkey and it's free for anyone to use. There's no point adding it to Monkey2 if HTML5 can't support Monkey2's planned features. I'm really glad it was part of Monkey, but have to admit it was limiting what Monkey could do on all the other platforms. |
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| DruggedBunny: and it's worth bearing in mind that we already have HTML5 in Monkey and it's free for anyone to use You do have a good point there. ;-) |
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| Agreed with DB. Monkey is still alive for that and it was the lowest common denominator holding everything else back. I use HTML5 all the time, but I am glad it is going. |
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| If MX2 outputs C/C++ then emscripten may be a solution to get your stuff onto Web browsers. |
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| Monkey2 is useless for me... here are Monkey, Haxe, Godot, Unity and over 100 C++ / Java Libs |
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| @dragon: Monkey2 is useless for me... Nothing's forcing you to use it. |
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| For me the only way to build apps in HTML5 is with Monkey. So i will always use Monkey and only Monkey to build HTML5 apps. I will also use Monkey 2 with great consideration because Mark is talentuous and he has already prouved is value with treasures like Blitz3D, BlitzMax, Blitz2D and Monkey. |
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| If I understand well the apprach, there will be a new mojo2 compatible with monkey 1 and 2 and that supports gl only. And monkey 1 won't be abandonned. So the idea is that for people who want more programming stuffs than generics monkey2 will feature that. And javascrip is left behind in monkey2 because it's the language that restrain more low level programming and powerfull stuffs (like pointers?). So if you want html5 full compatible ->monkey1 + mojo1 html5 webgl only ->monkey1 with mojo2 (with some 3d stuffs! may be more in the future?). For me it's a good news if we get a language that can run really smooth and that give the ability to get the most power out of the devices. I rather like native game-apps than the ones running on virtual machines (as a gamer). And as Monkey1 won't be abandonned I don't really see a problem. It's just something different to me. |
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