Future of Blitz3D
Blitz3D Forums/Blitz3D Programming/Future of Blitz3D
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| Does anyone have a roadmap for the future devlopment of Blitz3D? Im not interested in Max, just good old Blitz3D... I know this is not an easy question, but its one I need answered before jumping ship... ;) |
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| Here we go again... |
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| If this has been answered in another post then, I have no wish to restart a long thread. Which post? |
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| Its not that its been answered, its just that every week there is another speculation thread. BRL does not produce "Roadmaps" |
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| they could at least come by the forum and create a small post about it. it's been a long time and i'm getting pretty upset about it myself. if they're not going to continue to update it then why not say so?! |
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| t's been a long time and i'm getting pretty upset about it myself. You obviously missed update 1.98 which was released only three weeks ago? if they're not going to continue to update it then why not say so?! I seem to recall they did, sometime after Blitzmax was released. Any updates we got after that were a bonus. |
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| It has been said so on many occasions now! They will bugfix only. [edit] We were all shocked when Mark added DDS! |
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| Then doesn't the fact that DDS was added tell you that Blitz3d is still being updated and worked on? If Blitz3d was going to be abandoned by BRL then why bother? There are a LOT of Blitz3d users out there. Not all will switch to Blitzmax. If Blitz3d is abandoned then BRL will lose many customers and they know it. |
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| If Blitz3d is abandoned then BRL will lose many customers and they know it. Blitz 3D updates have always been free. We've had three updates per year for the last three years, and five updates so far in 2006.That aside, I don't think BRL will concern themselves too much with losing 'customers' who aren't giving them any profit. BRL is a business not a charity. |
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| Mark openly admits that DDS support was more due to Tom than himself, with Mark only "Adding sanity checks". |
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| So the official word, appart form DDS, is that no new features will be added? |
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| Charity is not selling a product to new customers. Do you think that potential customers will not read these threads? If Blitz3d is no longer updated would YOU purchase the system? I wouldn't. How many users of Blitz3d have also purchased other BRL software? A great many, I think. So I don't believe that you are correct when you say "who aren't giving them any profit." |
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| How many users of Blitz3d have also purchased other BRL software? A great many, I think. So I don't believe that you are correct when you say "who aren't giving them any profit." You're contradicting yourself - its only a few minutes since you pointed out, and I quote: There are a LOT of Blitz3d users out there. Not all will switch to Blitzmax. Given that those people most likely won't take a step back to Blitzplus or even Blitzbasic, and there's a free version of Maplet for Blitz3D users, what other BRL products are the die-hard Blitz3D fan base going to buy? |
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| "A great many" does not equate to "all"...no contradiction. Take a poll and find out how many Blitz3d users have bought Blitzmax, as well. |
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| I have bought many complete products that have not been in development anymore, because the developer deems them complete. IMO, B3D contains all it needs to contain for the new programmer, or just any programmer looking for some pure fun. Or prototyping even! and IMO, Max is a good step up from B3D. You dont have an official 3D module yet but it's DESIGNED so that you can choose your own! |
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| Do you then think that Blitz3d is a complete, stable product? I agree with you about it containing all it needs for the new programmer and prototyping, btw. |
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| http://blitzbasic.com/logs/userlog.php?user=1&log=507 carefully read the last sentence in the last worklogentry! ;) |
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| I see it as a complete stable product, yes. The one thing both Me and Evak wanted from B3D that it didn't have was DDS. We've stopped using B3D now but the DDS thing made us think about going back to our racer and upgrading it a bit, since it was the VRAM that was causing the problems.... |
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| I am also designing Max3D with older hardware somewhat in mind, but any such version - if it ever actually happens - will have *less* capabilities than Blitz3D. Which oddly enough increases the chance of a GL Blitz3D happening one day - unless Si H's MiniB3D gets there first! Holy F***!!! |
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| Blitz3d as it stands is neither complete nor stable. For the "complete" part, do all of the functions work as they are intended to? Hmmm...nope. How about the "stable" part? Are all of the bugs fixed? Hmmm...nope. Blitz3d, though a great product, still is not finished. Period. Interesting last sentence in Mark's worklog, btw. |
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| It is very stable. If there's one thing perhaps it could benefit from it would be stencil shadows but I don't need that, and beginners should rather busy themselves learning the language and getting to grips with it. Could you point out some bugs that aren't an OS bug or a compatibility issue? |
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| createTexture for one...when you set the flag to 4(masked) or 2(alpha)...have YOU been able to get it to work without a workaround? As far as the bugs go, easy enough to just take a quick look into the bug report forum. |
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| I've used Createtexture many times with those flags, so unless they have been broken recently.... As for the bug reports forum, I have a hard time finding any genuine problems that arent a compatibility issue or an OS issue. (Tablet PC for instance.) I think we need [SOLVED] and [genuine bug] tags. :P The only bugs I did find in my quick rummage were related to the spanky new DDS support, and theres been a bug fix to get rid of the teething issues. I've never, in my years of programming in B3D, come across any killer bugs, though in that time quite a few have been found by others and removed. I suggest trying darkbasic if you want to see some bugs... |
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| LOL...already tried DarkBasic...no thanks! ;) The CreateTexture issue IS a relatively recent one. If you try to create a texture with the mask flag set, it doesn't work. One workaround is to save the created texture and then reload it....NOW it will work properly. |
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| It will never be completely stable until they stop adding things to it. |
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| Well that's strange. Im going to have to dig out B3D and some old projects to see it. Also, I cant see it in the bug reports ;) but now you mention it i seem to remember something being mentioned about texture flags. That might be a DX thing by the way ;) Either way, to me B3D is complete, and these things will be ironed out when Mark gets bored of coding for blitzmax ;) |
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| I know...and I hope that they continue adding things, so I'm content with a not-so-stable product :) |
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| thanks kevin, i spent last night scratching my head about that. wasn't aware it wasn't working. do you have a code snippet for that? thanks again :) |
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| Blitz3D is complete to me, as well. Coming from 3dRad, though, it's a case of deja vu :P |
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| [stubborn] Blitz3D is stable. It's just got a few niggles- You can't crash it very easily AFAIK. :D [/stubborn] |
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; Code example to show workaround for CreateTexture using flag 4
Graphics3D 800,600,32,2
ClearTextureFilters
SetBuffer BackBuffer()
Global tex
Global cube=CreateCube()
EntityColor cube,0,255,0
camera=CreateCamera()
PositionEntity camera,0,0,-10
light=CreateLight()
PositionEntity light,0,50,0
plane=CreatePlane()
EntityColor plane,77,77,77
PositionEntity plane,0,-1,0
doTexture()
While Not KeyHit(1)
If KeyDown(200) MoveEntity camera,0,0,.1
If KeyDown(208) MoveEntity camera,0,0,-.1
TurnEntity cube,0,1,0
UpdateWorld
RenderWorld
Flip
Delay 10
Wend
End
Function doTexture()
tex=CreateTexture(64,64,4)
SetBuffer TextureBuffer(tex)
ClsColor 0,0,0
Cls
Color 0,255,0
For x=1 To 63 Step 5
For y=1 To 63 Step 5
Plot x,y
Next
Next
SaveBuffer(TextureBuffer(tex),"temp.bmp")
FreeTexture tex
tex=LoadTexture("temp.bmp",4)
EntityTexture cube,tex
SetBuffer BackBuffer()
End Function
Try this snippet... @markd - you're very welcome :) ***EDIT**** Updated version of code example including freeing of texture and clearing of texture filters |
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| Not sure what you're getting at - that code works fine, although it'd stop the sides of the cube from disappearing if you turn off mipmapping when you reload the texture. Should also free the original texture before reloading it so you don't end up with two copies in memory. |
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| Not a "polished" bit of code, GfK - just a quick "snippet" to point out something. The code was for markd because he was having problems with the CreateTexture function. The program wasn't meant to be a final version. For the sake of professionalism I COULD have freed the original texture, but I didn't see the need. |
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| nice thanks. i have another question for you but i'd rather email it. is that ok? |
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| that would be fine, markd |
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| i think all programming languages has got 'futures'. even the old QBasic for dos is very popular!! and all 'bad' programming languages will be used. for example darkBasic is a bad programming tool. and there are still some people who use it. or look: blitzbasic is so popular, that people are making shadow and particle systems and are also selling them. don't be afraid. use bb :) cya |
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| the problem is that people look at what is selling, and if it's not possible to make with a certain language... that certain language is worthless. |
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| Kevin I was answering to your question (or was it markd's?) about that texture problem. I used to write a function for you that will solve the problem, plus will fix the bleeding edges problem of masked textures. It's in the archives now. This really isn't a bug. It's just the way that if you draw or paint DX2D stuff to a texturebuffer, the alpha channel will be erased. i don't know exactly but I guess this is a directX "feature", since it happens during the Vram upload/refresh. As my function shows, there are easy ways around this limitation. If you ever tried to run games that are crashing frequently yet unpredictably and noless have been officially released, then you surely love blitz3d's extraordinary stability. There's no complete product in the world. Everything can be enhanced. But Blitz3D s a pretty complete product of its class. It is an easy to learn and to use compiler with a runtime library attached to the output. It supports a majority of DirectX7 Features and allows to create complex , fast and stabile 3D Programs. The next generation will be BMax With Max3D, that is using a modular system, so the size of the EXE's will depend on the functions included. With Max3D that hopefuly will be available in the end of this year we will get an opportunity for up-to-date game engines etc. using latest hardware technology. |
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| @jfk - thank you for your post. I'm sorry if I was misinterpreted but I DO believe that Blitz3d is a great product. I just don't want to see it go the way of 3dRad. I suppose that you can chalk my above posts up to wishful hoping and thinking. |
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| I'd happily pay for a decent update to blitz3D - I've looked at max and it just doesn't "do it" for me like B3D does, the main lackings of B3D imo as others have stated are in the way of shadows and proper 3D audio - most of the rest can be worked around without unpredictable/buggy hacks or hideously slow code. |
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| My 10p ...... I've been using Blitz in all it's incarations for a long long time. For the bedroom coder, like myself, looking to get into 3d, Blitz3d is king, make no mistake!! I've tried a number of other products with their nonsensical command sets. Stability and usability is key for anything I do programming wise and Blitz has never let me down yet. I have realised everything I set out to achieve and some. If you plan on writing a project with fancy graphics, shadows and other glorious graphical features then maybe it IS time for your to jump ship. I'll see you in another life ;) This product matches my ambitions but ( no dig intended ) for some people their ambitions far exceed their capabilities. Was that RAMspeak? Stevie |
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| The future of B3D is.... MAX3D. Max has been written to go where B3D could not go because of its structural limitations. B3D still gets a fair amount of fixes but don't expect any major new bells and whistles. |
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| B3d is stable as a rock !! Many commercial games,tools and applications have been produced in B3d ,none of these could have been done with a product that was unstable. I also don't understand why I should just expect to get free updates and features when buying software but not for other types of products. Maybe I should try taking my new car back to the garage after 3 months and demand that they install a free sat-nav or request that they improve the overall performance of the engine by 10% ? Why is software different ? I don't understand how its possible to have a "complete" product that is continually updated. Surely if it is complete then it doesn't require updating. There is a point when all "updates" are really feature adds. When I buy software I buy it for what it can do now - not for what it may do in a year's time. Updates for me are very welcome bonuses. The fact that the product IS getting updated - DDS support the latest - sort of throws the whole discussion out the window anyway. I have no problem paying for updates if any were forth coming- especially in the case of b3d - but it seems logical to me that future development will be concentrated on BMax. |
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| Was that RAMspeak? lol no - that only took one reading to understand it. Blitz3d as it stands is neither complete nor stable. What an incredible thing to say. Whilst I don't doubt you believe it to be true somehow, that's gonna need a very (very) severe definition of both 'complete' and 'stable'. |
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| I wonder how many commercial games have been "secretly" developed with B3D. I'm sure there are a few still on the shelf. |
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| It is a severe definition...I consider software to be stable only when ALL of the bugs have been ironed out. In the real world, though, this is not the case. I do admit that according to real-world standards Blitz3d is VERY stable. I'll not dispute the claim further. |
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| Is there any reason why the developers of Blitz cannot come in on this thread and put some of this uncertancy to bed? |
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| Blitz3D is alive and well at Blitz Research. The collaboration of Tom and Mark's efforts in the last update I thought made a lot of users very happy. It continues to be a very strong seller for BRL and has a growing number of licensed educational institutions teaching what I would imagine to be some really fun courses. |
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| Looks like Skid put the uncertanty to bed. You know, I find this statement very interesting. I wonder how many commercial games have been "secretly" developed with B3D. I'm sure there are a few still on the shelf. I bet you'd be surprised! |
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| I've seen a few B3D games for sale in Game. under the "Family Fun" tag. Game stopped selling the range a while back though... |
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