How about some thoughts on landscapes
Blitz3D Forums/Blitz3D Programming/How about some thoughts on landscapes
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| I've now pretty much finished the detail programming on my project and am ready to get to the final landscape making.I've used various modeling programs and I'm not sure if there might be something better. Here are my needs - sort of in order of importance. 1.No terrain.I need to use meshes. 2.Need to be able to create SMOOTH sweeps in x,y,z.That is,I don't want to move things vert-by-vert.Takes too long and hard to get nice and smooth. 3.Need to use a selected material in certain areas so a "paint-face" deal seems best here. Of course I need to create the material. 4.Number of verts probably not an issue except as it relates to Blitz restraints.Not time intensive when running in Blitz. 5.Would prefer to export in B3D but I know that may not be an option.If not I would need to use a format that will enable an import into blitz with material in tact.I don't would to put the texture on in Blitz. I probably have tried about 15 programs (some full and some demo) and believe it or not it seems like Gamespace does the job better than the others.Faster,better,less verts.I know it does not have the best reputation so I'd be interested in your comments on this item. Most certainly I'd llke to find what you guys think about other things that might be available. |
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| 1. A terrain can be a mesh. Did you mean no BlitzTerrain? 2.Move what things vert-by-vert? Why would you move anything vert-by-vert? How do you mean "smooth sweeps in xyz" ? wtf? 3.Paint-face? You mean blending different materials? I suggest you use vertex alpha and mix different meshes/surfaces. Thats what most good terrains do, if you want more than 2 materials. 4. Huh? Time intensive? Or did you mean resource demanding? 5. I'm beginning to understand what youre talking about. There are loads of terrain editors. Had a look at TED? http://www.d-grafix.com/softwareted.html Whats wrong with it? I doubt anyone will be able to help you. First you have to help yourself, not sure if you can... bye |
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| I like FLE, available in Toolbox->3D Terrain Tools. I think TED is the commercial version, but I don't really know. |
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| What programs have you used? Have you used ALE from Dyvision? It saves to .b3d, and .x as well! Oh yeah, when I've tried to load models in from TrueSpace, it didn't import the texture in with them. It would be interesting to know if GameSpace models would load in correctly! |
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| Lenn - do you no anything at all. Save your smart-mouth remarks for the kiddie forums.I think most people here make a distinction between meshes and terrains. jhocking -I've tried FLE and TED but they do not allow meshes as far as I can tell - just terrains.Just to clarify for that Lenn joker - you can"t move verts separately. Amanda - Right -tried TS with x-file and no material import. Gamespace will import fine in B3D. |
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| TED i think is going to allow mesh scenery drops later. Im assuming that when you refer to "meshes" in your last post that you mean drop models.. like scenery. Both FLE and TED export the terrains and meshes |
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| Okay, a) don't be a @#!*. I was wondering the exact same things as Lenn, but since he already asked them I didn't bother. b) The difference between "meshes" and "terrains" is not clear here. To me, the landscapes made with FLE are meshes, while "terrains" are created by using the LoadTerrain command in blitz. So in other words, I'm wondering the same thing Lenn asked. What do you mean when you say you want to make a landscape using meshes but no terrain? What exactly are you trying to create? You refer to landscapes, but you don't want terrain. What does that mean? |
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| jhocking. "Okay,a) don't be a @#/*" - What does this mean and why is it necessary? It seems to mw that a "mesh" includes verts that were individually movable.Mainly squares quaddivided or made triangles.Thats what is implied by most. "Terrains" are simply verts placed to form squares. hocking - how much clearer can I make myself. I didn't really ask for help from Lenn or jhocking I just wanted an opinion on model-makers that had some knowledge ; such as a few other here have shown. I'd still be interested in opinions on that subject. |
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| It seems to mw that a "mesh" includes verts that were individually movable.Mainly squares quaddivided or made triangles.Thats what is implied by most. "Terrains" are simply verts placed to form squares. Riiiight, clear as mud. How could I have missed that difference?[/sarcasm] But hey, apparently you don't want my help. Ciao! |
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| Maybe I've smoked too much tonight but I think I understand what you mean. Terrains ( in blitz at least ) only give uniform x, z coords so what you need is a modeller that supports bezier patches. Bezier patches will interpolate in all axis. I'm not sure if there are any free modellers which support this. You may find that you'd be better studying the technique and creating a blitz program to build the terrain meshes which you could then save as .B3d using some code in the archives. There is some bezier patch code in the archives and I have my own variant if you want a butchers. Stevie |
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| jhocking - I'm not looking to get into a pis*sing match with anyone on this forum.The people here have been invaluable to me in this project.So to avoid a problem I'd appreciate it if you would NOT respond to my posts in the future.As I said - most other people understand what I mean. Right Stevie - thats the difference. I'm not looking for a free modeler.I've got Gamespace,Milkshape,and Cosmos.All will do the job.Just wondered if anyone had problems with GS before I spend any excessive time with it.Or buy the full version.Milkshape is too time consuming and Cosmos just stinks. As for making my own routines - I'd love to and have had some ideas from others on the forum to do that.However,my math skills are only enough to make a simple setup and I need something pretty extensive. |
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| jhocking - I'm not looking to get into a pis*sing match with anyone on this forum.The people here have been invaluable to me in this project.So to avoid a problem Obviously you don't need any help. You already know everything, especially when it comes to communicating.I'd appreciate it if you would NOT respond to my posts in the future.As I said - most other people understand what I mean. Lenn - do you no anything at all. Do YOU *KNOW* (<--notice the spelling) anything at all?...As the song goes: "Hit the road, Jack..." |
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| Woah, everyone chill out! Jack, you need to be around these forums a little to know who is well-respected and knows what they're talking about. Both Lenn and jhocking _are_. (How much jhocking code do I have in my engine - at a guess at least three different algos - thanks jh) Lenn - do you no anything at all. Save your smart-mouth remarks for the kiddie forums. My guess is that English is not your first language. If that's the case, then take your time reading replies, and try to understnad that these people are taking the time to help you. They don't have to. Apologies would be in order now. |
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| Apologies??????????? What I'd like to do is be right beside you geeks and see if you had such smart mouths then.I ask a reasonable question and got only smart-*ss answers. |
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| From hocking-- I doubt anyone will be able to help you. First you have to help yourself, not sure if you can... from len-- Riiiight, clear as mud. How could I have missed that difference?[/sarcasm] But hey, apparently you don't want my help. Ciao! from blackledge-- My guess is that English is not your first language. If that's the case, then take your time reading replies, and try to understnad that these people are taking the time to help you. They don't have to. Apologies would be in order now. As for using "no" rather than "know".I don't have time to proof read everyting or time or post 5500 times like some others.If you want to respond to my questions without mouthing off;fine.If not - ------------------ The more I think of this the more pi*ssed I get.These are responses I get for no reason.I've been around here for at least four years and never made a smart remark to anyone. |
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| jack - you are really over-reacting - I find nothing offensive or smart-ass in the replys to your post - a bit of gentle banter maybe - but both posters took the time to try and answer you. People will be less likely to try and help in case their posts are taken the wrong way. In your last post you also attributed the quotes to the wrong person - careful - if you quote someone on a public forum then make sure that the quote is attributed to the right person. |
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| I don't think lenn's post helps though. However, i know how frustrating looking for the right terrain program. I ended up building my terrains in a modeller, because every single other terrain program i've used, uses a heightmap to create the terrain. What i wanted is something to import a mesh, i built, and paint it, using the terrain painting tools they offer. Sorry for the mini hi-jack. |
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| Hi Jack, All the terrain programs in the toolbox are fairly unique in their own way: TED ALE FLE and PANORAMA definitely do meshes, vertex alpha blended textures. TED and AlE can rener this to supertextures for X format (not sure about panorama, check their site). Or as a vertex alpha B3D. ALE can place objects like a dropper and lightmap them, but is limited in terrain size. TED and Panorama can make multiple tiled terrains, in effect bigger than 64x64. FLE is a free one, and i think it can handle X & B3D for a terrain block with blended textures. As i said, theyre all good at what they do in their own way, i guess you just need to try them out. I cant speak for the other ones, mabe someone else can? |
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Adding terrain support to 3D World Studio: |
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| Pimpjacked! |
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| Landscapes are nice, scenery would be boring without them. |
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| I know that it doesn't do much of what you want, but I highly recommend L3DT for landscapes. The current version exports meshes (I think), and it looks like the next one is going to be really great. (Texture splatting :D ) http://users.tpg.com.au/blakest2/l3dt/ |
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| Ross C : I see you understand what I need and that a good modeler that does everythingI need (not much really) is hard to find.I also wnat to build mine in a modeler,or something like it. D-Grafix : I've looked at your T.Ed and it is real nice.I did not find that I could move vertex in x,y,z directions.Am I wrong (I hope).I have also used all the others you mention. johndevoy -Right Mr Picklesworth.L3DT is something I have not seen.Is this an abreviation for something? I"ll do a Google search and see what I can find. Halo - I"ve looked at 3dWorld and like it a lot.When you say you are adding terrain support I wonder if you mean the type mesh I need? That would sure do the trick. Thanks for the input people.Some good thoughts. You are the type people that I"ve fould so helpfull in the past years. |
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| Jack, Welcome to your reality check. Calm down. I find you offensive. This is coming from an unbiased third party who doesn't know any of the posters in this thread. What I'd like to do is be right beside you geeks and see if you had such smart mouths then. Veiled threats of physical violence = not cool. Not that this was the only thing that offended me. Please, let's all be nice to each other. If you feel someone's making a cutting remark, just ignore it. |
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| Ted does export meshes X & b3d, it can do a smooth and noise sweep and you can edit the verts. Theres a couple of demos (with meshes and textures) in blitz and darkbasic on the website: www.d-grafix.com/softwareted.html The darkbasic one is also worth getting as it features the newer X export. |
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| D-Grafix T-ed is really nice and I'm glad to see verts can be moved on the horizontal plane.I do not seem to be able get any movement in the application I downloaded.Is this a demo of all features or just for viewing? |
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| Octhorpe - No threat.It is been my experience that many people on forums say things that they never would say if they were in the presence of others. This was a quote in another topic a couple days ago.--- "As for your idea, You really should consider not using terrains at all as meshes are much faster. They don't have LOD, but if you put 9 terrains together you will get 9 times the LOD processing but without the benefit of the terrains being glued together, so the individual tiles will always show." Note the use of the term terrains and meshes. |
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| >Octhorpe - No threat.It is been my experience that many >people on forums say things that they never would say if >they were in the presence of others. Why don't you shut down your PC and take a long walk to clear your head. When you get back online, your first act should be to apologize to the people you have insulted and disrespected. You have initiated every single negative exchange in this thread and called a number of very nice people names, and then you started making threats. You might want to consider that access to this forum is not a right but a privilege, and as such can be removed until such time as you choose to conduct yourself in a civil manner. Andy |
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| @ Andy & Jack ...... now this is getting rediculous. Unless your both 12 years olds which I guess is not the case then can I suggest either having a romano-grecko bare arsed wrestle to settle it ....... or ...... take a leaf out of Lenn and James's book and ignore the thread .... I'm pretty sure that any of the comments above are water off a ducks back to the pair of them!! |
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| >Stevie G< Have you read the thread? Propably not, if you had you wouldn't be confusing who said and did what. I posted once because Jack dragged me into this thread and was going to leave it at that, but then you came to Jacks rescue and dragged me back into it. Andy |
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| Came to Jacks rescue? Now behave yourself or I'll call yer dad ;) |
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| Oh dear. Feel free to start again... |
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