Did I Buy The Wrong Thing?
Blitz3D Forums/Blitz3D Beginners Area/Did I Buy The Wrong Thing?
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| I just purchased Blitz3D and I understand its running DX7? My goodness, I was not aware of that, I don't care about DX10, but DX9 is current standard. I have read this Blitz3D will not be upgraded but will one of the other products be? And if so, will there be a discount for switching over? Anyone know? *soft frown* |
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| Yes, there has been a lot of discussion about this. Blitz3D uses DX7 and will not be upgraded. The development has continued on Max3D (BlitzMax). Why did you choose Blitz3D? Have you looked at any alternatives ? If Blitz3D is a good buy depends on what you want to do with it. Maybe looking through the Gallery is a good idea. Blitz3D supports no hardware shadows or shaders. However it is reported to work on Vista. |
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| Lemme put it this way, Merrie: B3D is a fast, easy-to-use, and undeniably powerful programming language, great for pretty much any type of standard-to-high-quality game. However, if you're trying to make the next World Of Warfare, or Quake, or Half-Life, then B3D probably (not definitely) won't give you the results you want. Still, it's not something that should be underestimated; I've seen screenshots in the gallery of things like water animation, using B3D, that blew my mind... It all depends on what you'll be making. |
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| I dont get it. What the big deal with it needing to be DX9. This is not just you merrie, but everyone. Was Half life in DX9? Was Deus EX in DX9? Was incoming in DX9? Was Need for speed in DX9? The list is endless. If you are a big software house with like a million staff to do Graphics and stuff, then not using DX9 is a shame. However if its just you, or just you and a mate. Then DX7 is good enough. And when you write something thats only as good as UNREAL, then complain |
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| "Merrie" if you want 3D stuff then stay with Blitz3D. BlitzMax is probably a long way off having an official 3D 'engine'. Download the demo for BMax if you have not already and play about with it. If you want 3D for BMax then you will have to write it yourself or use a 3rd party 'engine'. |
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| I think that Blitz3d is still pretty decent, but it all depends what you want to do and your level of expertise. However, in general, I suspect that DX7 is more than enough for most people here - me included. I honestly don't think that you'll be disappointed with blitz3d if you give it a shot. Most people seem to want DX9/10 support because they think that it will make their games better looking, when really that's down to the quality of the media that people use. Which is something that Puki seems to be well aware of... ;) |
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| Merrie, To make a really good game here's what you need: (1) Good to excellent programmers and some 'what makes a great game' kinda knowledge, ability to programme nice pretty things like particles, powerful and efficient data structures, and someone who knows about levels/maps/powerups and other fun additions to many games. (2) Good to excellent graphics guys - 3D modelling, texturing, animations, 2D graphics, gui stuff, who know about alpha channels and masking. (3) Good to excellent musicians and audio guys to produce some great original sound effects and atmospheric musc, plus changes in tempo/pace and style to provide a fabul;ous atmosphere to the game. (4) A fantastic game designer who knows the ropes and exactly what the best ingredients are to making a top game and how to get the best gameplay out of any situation, along with a what puzzles to use where and how to introduce the player to the learning curve of the game he/she has planned for them. Wouldn't you agree that most of what you need to make the best game is in that list? Well there's no mention of DirectX 9, or 8 or 7 or anything. because its not what you have, but what you do with it. Smoke and mirrors do not a good game make. They don't make a game worth playing. They can add a little to the visual enjoyment of a game, but look at some of the best feats of eye candy in the gaming world, and you'll see many hiding a poor game beyond the surface. B3D is robust, tried, tested, fast to develop with, easy to learn, full of useful features, incredibly fast, uses many game industry standard file formats and comes at an incredibly reasonable price. Don't worry or faulter, you just bought into a much bigger world, one you can control, and one with plenty of examples to be shared amongst the brotherhood of Blitz. Look forward to BlitzMax 3D sure, we all are, but it is not coming for a long while, so now has never been a better time to get stuck into B3D and you'll see that 3D game YOU always wanted to make is right in the palm of your hands. Thats my thought anyway. |
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| I absolutely agree with all the above, but I would also add: don't feel too discouraged if it turns out that you can't make the 3d game that you always wanted. Few people can. Just playing around with Blitz3d can be fun, even if you never actually complete anything. |
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| @IPete, Exactly the point I was trying to make, but made better |
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| To think, when I first heard about blitz, I almost bought BlitzPlus instead of Blitz3D! :/ |
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| H&K, Exactly right, "cut your cloth" as my mum would say! Lol! IPete2. |
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| Ok, thanks for all the comments, I appreciate it, and all of it makes sense, including the quality of your graphics etc. I have seen demos of quality from DX earlier to DX 9 and there is a bit of difference, but I'll keep an open mind here and do some more peeking about. Yes, my eventual creation will need the 3D aspect of B3D is what I will want to work with until/unless the 3D mod comes out for the other package. As I am learning, Im taking baby steps and doing what I need to do before launching into my 'dream baby'. Its a 3D Virtual chat, but I won't say more about it :) Again thanks for the feedback. |
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| Merrie, If you need a little more evidence, check out my stuff most of the 3D real-time stuff is done in B3D. www.smartscreenuk.com IPete2. |
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| Oh also Download this (Its a better IDE for B3d) www.proteanide.whispertablet.co.uk/final/ProteanFinal.exe |
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| Wow IPete2 that is an impressive website, great screen shots. Thank you so much for sharing! |
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| Merrie, Thanks that's very kind - 6 years of graft... and there's (hopefully) some more to come yet which may even be better, although I think beating the ss Great Britain project will be hard! IPete2. |
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| Wow, IPete2! Way to go man! Smartscreen looks FABULOUS!!! That should be your answer, Merrie: B3D has more power & capability than any single third-party programmer could utilize any time soon. I suggest you stick with it; don't sweat the DX thing! |
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| Blitz3D in his 'purity'is not something powerfull regarding quality VFX you looking for...BUT, with extensions such as Particle Candy, Sprite Candy and few other DLL based libs, it will reach very very high standards...in upcoming 3D platformer me and few fellas working on, we have DOF, Bloom, Motion blur, with decent speed..in Blitz3D..soon first screenshoots will pop up so you can see for yourself.. |
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| well, decent speed? What are you useing, dlls or some tricky blitz code? Don't get me wrong, Blitz3D is my absolute favorite tool around here. Neverless, watch my case. I am working on a standard FPS shooter engine for several years now. While in the beginning the tech gap between my engine and the market leaders wasn't so obvious, it's now looking kind of like "last century". There is now a remarkable lack of features: -support for proper shadows - including hardware-accellerated shadow volume creation. (DevilsChild's engine may be the best solution right now, but still not industry speed) -support for vertex shaders -support for pixel shaders -easy to use, stabile, fast built in physics But it really takes a lot until you hit the limits of BLitz3D and DX7. It's not the way that you need shaders on day 2 of your engine project. Neverless, if you really plan to do a commercial fps game or so, it will be pretty chanceless without a minimum of standard gfx features. (DOF, Bloom, MOtion blur, BW/Green filters, etc. proper bumbmapping) and therefor a huge waste of 3d artwork. That's why I still didn't gave up my hope for Max3D for Blitzmax. |
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| DLL's JFK...level with 45K running fine with DOF and BLOOM on my FX5600 here is screenshot from upcomming 3D platformer I am working on past 2 months..  I'm working now on my grass system, DLL based too, in order to really cover huge space with acceptable speed... |
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| sounds good, can't see the image. |
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| ..ok, I reload image again..I hope it works fine now.. |
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| The DOF looks great. Personally I always had to do multiple renderworld for DOF in blitz, or to use a number of alpha layer quads and that's very slow too. May I ask how does your DOF work? |
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| Very sharp picture, nicely done, Im learning alot from reading this information. Thanks for sharing. |
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| @Adam thanks for the praise - that's nice to hear! @Naughty that is looking sweet dude, when can we expect a demo? Naughty Alien is quite right - B3D is MUCH bigger than the sum of its parts, look what else there is... ...I am proud owner and user of many B3d libraries, of Sprite Candy, Particle Candy, Swifts Shadow System, Gile[s] (see NNC radioactive environment - all real-time in B3d, my own small particle engine (see ss GB), Barliesques wonderful light flare routines, 3D World Studo (Leadwerks), Pacemaker, BCF 3.0 and TerraEd, Treeg Magic Professional, all made using Blitz products. I have some other none B3d products too, but its what best fits the brief which I turn to, including collision libraries and at least 2 physics libraries. BUT I wouldn't be far from also mentioning that this forum is often the source of many, many fine artists and programmers who have helped me out over the years, in particular Avon, Nigel Brown, Shawn Swift, Josh Klint, and many more. So it is a much bigger world than people seem to remember, when you join the B3D ranks. IPete2. PS As Bruce Lee once said "It is like a finger, pointing a way to the Moon. Don't concentrate on the finger or you will miss all the heavenly glory." |
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| So it is a much bigger world than people seem to remember, when you join the B3D ranks You are ours now. You bought d3b, next you will buy a particle engine. You might resist, you might fight with all your will. But in the end you will be begging for an update to Grass Magic. Sprite Candy, Particle Candy, Swifts Shadow System, Gile[s] (see NNC radioactive environment - all real-time in B3d, my own small particle engine (see ss GB), Barliesques wonderful light flare routines, 3D World Studo (Leadwerks), Pacemaker, BCF 3.0 and TerraEd, Treeg Magic Professional IPete2 is right, but one thing that he didnt make clear, is that if your fancy takes you in that direction, every single one of those products could be written by you.That is they dont have any fancy c++ or os codes embeded within them. If you have lots of time and little money you could write an addin just as good as say Swifts shadow system. And more importantly, if you asked for help whilst doing it, swift would probably help you. |
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| Thanks guys Im really honored :) |
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| www.d-grafix.com/?page=jetscream This was the first game/program i wrote in B3D, i started with a small boat demo and then added a bit, added a bit more and then finished up with that, with virtually no design or direction, the levels are inefficient, code is a mess (lol and how i cringe when i read my code for it :) my point is, the results are not bad for a first try, B3D is real easy to learn,. Ok i had a fair bit of programming/3d knowlage before which helped, but With what ive learned since in b3d (mostly thanks to this great community who really bend over to help) I could have made it 100x better. Also there are ways to do some of the shading and shadows etc. using clever software tricks or some of the cool libs people bring out from time to time. Answer: if you want to write your first 3d game (even to sell!) then no you disnt buy the wrong thing. |
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| @D-Grafix, Requirements:DX8 Compatible 3DCard? |
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| H&K, Good grief you are absolutely right I never even though to mention that - ah well thanks for picking up where I "dropped it!" ;) D-Grafix - you are right too. Although the selling may be an issue with a "first" game. IPete2. |
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| . "Requirements:DX8 Compatible 3DCard?" Lol, when i wrote it i wasnt sure, i had DX8(or 9???) installed and it was working, thats how much i cared about which verion i was using, I was just happy to break from programming 2d stuff in pascal/C into 3d stuff. "selling may be an issue with a "first" game." Jetscream was my first 3d game, Ive sold a few copies, but, then a company approached me to change it for jetbikes for a kids ride for 4-10 Y/olds (like those things you see in supermarkets etc), then again for snow mobiles. Its well paid for itself (altho doing mods to and improving old spaghetti code was hard work :)    since then all ive been doing is custom stuff for other peoples games and writing tools :( BTW, Naughty Alien, that looks fantastic! Ipete, are you a Bristol man per-chance (i notice the SS GB)?? |
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| Hiya Dan, I only just noticed this, no I am based in Warrington, near Manchester. I was commissioned to create ss GB from scratch. What was great is that it came at the right time for me as a project, just when I needed it! :) Hey your Icerider and jetbike games embedded into kids play machines, what a great idea! I hope they come back for more! Where are you based? IPete2. |
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| I grew up in WestonSMare but lived in bristol for a while (i remember a schooltrip round ssgb when i was at about 10) That was before they remade the interior, before it was just an empty hulk with scaffold walkways. I now live in sweden (long story) |
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| Blitz 3D does everything it says on the tin, and thanks to the librariees and code-arcs generated by the community, many workarounds for non-DX7 functionality have been synthesized to impressive levels. I would not let the DX7 put you off, unless of course, you are a multi-thousand dollar software house!!! Stick with Blitz if you want a nice, easy to use, language with a great community. My guess is, a year from now, you'll not have even scratched the surface of all that is possible with it :D |
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