FMOD is included?

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TartanTangerine (was Indiepath)

(Posted 2007) [#1]

Please tell me FMOD is included as it was with Blitz3D or are we back to the BlitzMax Audio (nightmare) scenario?

ninjarat

(Posted 2007) [#2]

I dunno. I do know that Blitz3D and the SDK have their own audio commands, which are much faster and more memory efficient, so yeah, maybe, but either way there's no need to use Max Audio.

TartanTangerine (was Indiepath)

(Posted 2007) [#3]

If it does include FMOD then purchasing the SDK will be a better and cheaper option for people wanting FMOD capabilities and compatibility.

big10p

(Posted 2007) [#4]

I think Blitz3D uses an older/cutdown version of FMOD though, if that's of any consequence?!

iamnothing

(Posted 2007) [#5]

Don't you have to license FMOD anyway to make use of it? I thought that the B3D support was for compatibility and not licensing. If so, it would be a great addition because of the indie license pricing.

Dreamora

(Posted 2007) [#6]

Last mentioned it was a cut down FMod 3.6.X that was part of B3D but you might want to checkout the changelogs of B3D to be sure (last update was somewhere between 1.88 and 1.98)

TartanTangerine (was Indiepath)

(Posted 2007) [#7]

But is it included in the SDK?

Gabriel

(Posted 2007) [#8]

I'd like to know this too. I know what was part of Blitz3D, but this is not Blitz3D, and it's not published through Idigicon, so it would be dangerous to assume that the SDK is the same as B3D in this regard. An official reply would be great.

ninjarat

(Posted 2007) [#9]

Blitz3D sound is definitely FMod driven. As an experiment I took a B3DSDK app, an example, and ran it after temporarily removing fmod.dll from my system32 dir. and it gave me the 'ol you can't run this 'cause you don't have the whatever.dll message. Try it, I got consistent results with all B3D and B3DSDK apps on my machine. And I used the Framework command to make sure pub.mod/fmod.mod didn't get imported.

I'm sure it uses FMod. Fortunately for me I already own an indie/shareware license for FMod, but if you're just going to use it in one game (good enough a license for starters) it's only a hundred US dollars, very reasonable for such a good library.

H&K	(Posted 2007) [#10]

Fortunately for me I already own an indie/shareware license for FMod

Does that mean that if I dont have a license for FMod that I cannot include any sound/music commands from the SDK in a game?

I was under the impression that as long as I avoided MP3s licenses were not a problem

Anyway, so as I would be adding something, the SDKB3D examples compile for me, and I dont have a FMod.DLL anywhere on my HD. So, it definatly doesnt include FMod as a seperate DLL

ninjarat

(Posted 2007) [#11]

Windows comes with an older version of FMod that's complete freeware, and that one is OK to use without a license, which is what's used in B3D. I THINK. I'm not sure. Have a look at their site http://www.fmod.org

Hotcakes

(Posted 2007) [#12]

No it doesn't. You have no idea. Sorry =]

I don't know how you managed to give yourself errors by removing that dll, because I don't have it and I can run every B3D (and B3DSDK - not that I've tried) exe under the sun. It's never and will never come with Windows (at least not with XP or Vista).

FMOD is compiled into B3D's dll. BRL havn't said much about it, but I feel pretty confident saying that it's a one-off license granted to BRL for inclusion in their products and as such is a cut down version of FMOD with no support (ie old version, less features). Since B3DSDK _IS_ B3D, those functions remain unchanged. My guess is that this is the main reason why BRL havn't open sourced it, too, other than Mark's (over-)protectiveness.

Anyhoo, the FMOD license is passed onto us, the cost included in the pricing for the B3D/SDK package. MP3 support is a seperate license from another company. If you need the extra features, updates or support for FMOD, you will need to use their dll and buy a standard license (which is cheap).

@Tim, I don't use B3DSDK. Everything said in this topic so far is heresay. I'd suggest you mail BRL directly, because they don't seem to be in a rush to answer you here - and they are the only ones who know. Please pass the info onto us if you hear something from them =]

DStastny

(Posted 2007) [#13]

@Hotcakes is correct just dump the dll imports and you can see what dependencies the DLL has at load time.

Imports from MSACM32.dll
    (hint = 0003) acmDriverClose
    (hint = 001D) acmFormatTagDetailsA
    (hint = 0009) acmDriverOpen
    (hint = 0006) acmDriverEnum
    (hint = 0027) acmStreamOpen
    (hint = 002A) acmStreamSize
    (hint = 0028) acmStreamPrepareHeader
    (hint = 0025) acmStreamConvert
    (hint = 002B) acmStreamUnprepareHeader
    (hint = 0024) acmStreamClose
    (hint = 0004) acmDriverDetailsA
    (hint = 0023) acmMetrics

Imports from USER32.dll
    (hint = 0286) SetWindowTextA
    (hint = 008E) DefWindowProcA
    (hint = 0231) ScreenToClient
    (hint = 024D) SetCursor
    (hint = 0202) PostMessageA
    (hint = 0244) SetCapture
    (hint = 0229) ReleaseCapture
    (hint = 000D) BeginPaint
    (hint = 00C8) EndPaint
    (hint = 0145) GetParent
    (hint = 015D) GetSystemMetrics
    (hint = 01EC) MoveWindow
    (hint = 0280) SetWindowLongA
    (hint = 02B3) UnregisterClassA
    (hint = 0174) GetWindowRect
    (hint = 016E) GetWindowLongA
    (hint = 0193) InvalidateRect
    (hint = 010B) GetCursorPos
    (hint = 013A) GetMessageA
    (hint = 0200) PeekMessageA
    (hint = 00A1) DispatchMessageA
    (hint = 024F) SetCursorPos
    (hint = 00FF) GetClientRect
    (hint = 0040) ClientToScreen
    (hint = 010E) GetDesktopWindow
    (hint = 0257) SetForegroundWindow
    (hint = 0292) ShowWindow
    (hint = 028E) ShowCursor
    (hint = 0099) DestroyWindow
    (hint = 00D2) EnumDisplayMonitors
    (hint = 02BC) UpdateWindow
    (hint = 0060) CreateWindowExA
    (hint = 0216) RegisterClassA
    (hint = 01BA) LoadCursorA
    (hint = 029F) ToAscii
    (hint = 01DF) MessageBoxA
    (hint = 01D6) MapVirtualKeyA
    (hint = 0299) SystemParametersInfoA
    (hint = 0283) SetWindowPos

Imports from KERNEL32.dll
    (hint = 028D) OutputDebugStringA
    (hint = 0169) GetFullPathNameA
    (hint = 01BD) GetStringTypeW
    (hint = 01BA) GetStringTypeA
    (hint = 0174) GetLocaleInfoA
    (hint = 0337) SetStdHandle
    (hint = 01CA) GetSystemTimeAsFileTime
    (hint = 0143) GetCurrentProcessId
    (hint = 01DF) GetTickCount
    (hint = 02A3) QueryPerformanceCounter
    (hint = 0157) GetEnvironmentStringsW
    (hint = 00F7) FreeEnvironmentStringsW
    (hint = 0155) GetEnvironmentStrings
    (hint = 00F6) FreeEnvironmentStringsA
    (hint = 0193) GetOEMCP
    (hint = 00FD) GetACP
    (hint = 02B5) ReadFile
    (hint = 031B) SetFilePointer
    (hint = 01E3) GetUserDefaultLCID
    (hint = 0133) GetConsoleMode
    (hint = 0122) GetConsoleCP
    (hint = 01B7) GetStartupInfoA
    (hint = 0166) GetFileType
    (hint = 0324) SetHandleCount
    (hint = 0212) HeapCreate
    (hint = 0214) HeapDestroy
    (hint = 021C) HeapSize
    (hint = 0328) SetLastError
    (hint = 0364) TlsFree
    (hint = 0366) TlsSetValue
    (hint = 0363) TlsAlloc
    (hint = 0365) TlsGetValue
    (hint = 017D) GetModuleFileNameA
    (hint = 01B9) GetStdHandle
    (hint = 03A4) WriteFile
    (hint = 0104) GetCPInfo
    (hint = 0245) LCMapStringW
    (hint = 0394) WideCharToMultiByte
    (hint = 0244) LCMapStringA
    (hint = 021A) HeapReAlloc
    (hint = 01A3) GetProcessHeap
    (hint = 01E9) GetVersionExA
    (hint = 00AF) EnumSystemLocalesA
    (hint = 0241) IsValidLocale
    (hint = 023F) IsValidCodePage
    (hint = 0175) GetLocaleInfoW
    (hint = 0399) WriteConsoleA
    (hint = 0135) GetConsoleOutputCP
    (hint = 03A3) WriteConsoleW
    (hint = 0053) CreateFileA
    (hint = 0056) CreateFileW
    (hint = 0310) SetEndOfFile
    (hint = 00EE) FlushFileBuffers
    (hint = 00F8) FreeLibrary
    (hint = 0110) GetCommandLineA
    (hint = 0146) GetCurrentThreadId
    (hint = 0210) HeapAlloc
    (hint = 01A0) GetProcAddress
    (hint = 0252) LoadLibraryA
    (hint = 0356) Sleep
    (hint = 017F) GetModuleHandleA
    (hint = 0275) MultiByteToWideChar
    (hint = 0034) CloseHandle
    (hint = 0316) SetEvent
    (hint = 0390) WaitForSingleObject
    (hint = 004F) CreateEventA
    (hint = 0383) VirtualFree
    (hint = 0381) VirtualAlloc
    (hint = 022C) InterlockedIncrement
    (hint = 0228) InterlockedDecrement
    (hint = 0223) InitializeCriticalSection
    (hint = 0081) DeleteCriticalSection
    (hint = 0098) EnterCriticalSection
    (hint = 0251) LeaveCriticalSection
    (hint = 035E) TerminateProcess
    (hint = 0142) GetCurrentProcess
    (hint = 036E) UnhandledExceptionFilter
    (hint = 034A) SetUnhandledExceptionFilter
    (hint = 0239) IsDebuggerPresent
    (hint = 02A7) RaiseException
    (hint = 02D7) RtlUnwind
    (hint = 0171) GetLastError
    (hint = 0216) HeapFree
    (hint = 00B9) ExitProcess

Imports from DINPUT.dll
    (hint = 0001) DirectInputCreateEx

Imports from WINMM.dll
    (hint = 00A3) timeGetTime
    (hint = 00A5) timeSetEvent
    (hint = 00A4) timeKillEvent
    (hint = 00A0) timeEndPeriod
    (hint = 00A1) timeGetDevCaps
    (hint = 0040) mciSendStringA

Imports from GDI32.dll
    (hint = 0039) CreateFontA
    (hint = 002D) CreateCompatibleDC
    (hint = 020E) SelectObject
    (hint = 01BC) GetTextMetricsA
    (hint = 008C) DeleteDC
    (hint = 008F) DeleteObject
    (hint = 0003) AddFontResourceA
    (hint = 0151) GetCharABCWidthsA
    (hint = 0215) SetBkColor
    (hint = 023C) SetTextColor
    (hint = 00DD) ExtTextOutA
    (hint = 01A5) GetStockObject
    (hint = 01F8) RemoveFontResourceA
    (hint = 01B4) GetTextExtentPoint32A

Imports from ole32.dll
    (hint = 0010) CoCreateInstance
    (hint = 0069) CoUninitialize

No load time references to the FMOD. I expect the license issue if FMOD is in there was resovled by BRL with the owners of FMOD. Considering the version used by B3D they proably consider it fair use under the orignial B3D license.

Doug

Robert Cummings

(Posted 2007) [#14]

Simple question: do i need to ship fmod.dll with my product?

H&K	(Posted 2007) [#15]

No ;)

As shown by Hotcakes, (and I), both the SDK and B3D run without FMod on our respective computers.

(There is a little itsy bitsy chance that the Run DLL, is different to the Development DLL, and that you then do need FMod. But That would be stupid, and would definatly needed to have been documented. Im still sticking with my catagoric NO, but just mentioned this for completeness)

Robert Cummings

(Posted 2007) [#16]

Thanks :)

ninjarat

(Posted 2007) [#17]

I wonder what the hell was causing that error on my machine? I left the FMod module out. :-/