General linux question:

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DH(Posted 2009) [#1]
Anyone know how I can get around needing GLIBC_2.4 for Blitzmax on linux? I am not doing any GUI stuff (not even graphical), and only need stdin and stdout (well, for an interface)


slenkar(Posted 2009) [#2]
why do you need to get around needing the lib?

Are you using a bad distro that makes it difficult to install that?


xlsior(Posted 2009) [#3]
Perhaps it may just not be present by default on a GUI-less server install?
Why add dependencies when you don't need them?


DH(Posted 2009) [#4]
Ahh, sry:

I was trying to get a client/server up and running quickly (figured Blitzmax would be a good solution for prototyping).

I am leasing a linux server (we'll call it my satellite).
I have a Ubuntu VM installed for local dev and testing.
The client will be on any platform.

I got everything up and running in the client and VM. Went to transfer the executable from the VM to the satellite and got this error when trying to run it:
error while loading shared libraries: libGLU.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory



Figured the satellite didn't have everything that the compiled executable needed so I put Blitzmax on the satellite and tried to compile it there(usinb bmk), but bmk returns this error on the satellite:
./bmk: /lib/tls/libc.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.4' not found (required by ./bmk)


I dont need anything graphical (heck, the server doesnt use the graphics commands at all, just stdin & stdout and a bit of networking).


DH(Posted 2009) [#5]
Why add dependencies when you don't need them?

Is there a way for me to compile it on the Ubuntu VM without needing the gfx libraries?


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#6]
type:

If you want to run:
sudo apt-get install libglu1-mesa

then if you want to develop:
sudo apt-get install libglu-mesa-dev

that should take care of libGLU.so.1.

Ypu probably need it because of Max2D or the Gui lib needs it. I believe there is a way of excluding these moduless

PS: I tend to install the dev package for libglut3-dev because i use other stuff that needs it, not sure if bmax does.

.


DH(Posted 2009) [#7]
I can't alter the satellite's OS :-(


DH(Posted 2009) [#8]
.... This is always so frustrating...
I often think it's me, but it can't be... I use C#, C++, Delphi, Java, Objective C and PHP on a daily basis and I have no problem understanding them?!? But blitzmax just seems to be so picky yet picky with no basis for being picky (or not enough documentation to support why it's being picky)....

I thought maybe if I use the framework stuff, it would cut out this glib. So put these frameworks at the top of the main file per this document:
For example, to create a 'stripped down' BASIC application, you can use the BRL.Basic framework:

Framework BRL.Basic 'create a stripped down app

Print "Hello World!"
When a building a multifile application, the framework (if any) found in the main source file is automatically passed to all 'child' files in the application. However, if you change this 'default' framework, you will need to 'rebuild all' for the change to affect other files.



I have a multifile app, but I don't know what the "rebuild all" is (or where to find it...).

My frameworks are:
Framework BRL.Basic
Framework BRL.System
Framework BRL.Socket
Framework BRL.Bank
Framework BRL.SocketStream
Framework BRL.LinkedList
Framework BRL.StandardIO
Framework BRL.Map

However when i compile it, one of the includes says that a 'Print' isnt found.... But I have the StandardIO framework right there!!!!


DH(Posted 2009) [#9]
Mind you if I change the order of the frameworks at the top of the main file like so:
Framework BRL.Basic
Framework BRL.System
Framework BRL.Socket
Framework BRL.Map
Framework BRL.Bank
Framework BRL.SocketStream
Framework BRL.LinkedList
Framework BRL.StandardIO

It'll complain that a TMap isn't found in another include......


Amon(Posted 2009) [#10]
Have you tried:

Framework BRL.Blitz

then the rest of them?


DH(Posted 2009) [#11]
Yeah, does the same thing. When I go to build, it opens one of the includes and says "Indentifier 'Print' not found"


nawi(Posted 2009) [#12]
glibc and libGLU are completely different things. It may be that you have wrong glibc version. There's a linux forum with guides for Ubuntu though.


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#13]
I can't alter the satellite's OS :-(
why? no root password? by leasing do you mean it is by remote X client or you actually lease a server? If so those you lease it from should install what you need if you ask.

Lol if it were a local windows server i could tell you how to circumvent the admin passwd in no time, but i have no experience with knocking out a su/sudo. (except by taking out the disk and using another linux machine)

i wonder if it is possible to use a ubuntu liveCD to add yourself to the sudoers file :/


slenkar(Posted 2009) [#14]
try 'framework assistant'


DH(Posted 2009) [#15]
why? no root password? by leasing do you mean it is by remote X client or you actually lease a server? If so those you lease it from should install what you need if you ask.

It's a multi-user dedicated box from a hosting company. So there are a few hundred other users using the box as well. If I request an alteration, they usually give me the "it may impact others" and such.

I'll just try and request they add the lib and be done with it.... Linux-fail!


TaskMaster(Posted 2009) [#16]
Maybe you can ask them to move your hosting to a server that supports the version you need.


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#17]
It's a multi-user dedicated box from a hosting company. So there are a few hundred other users using the box as well. If I request an alteration, they usually give me the "it may impact others" and such.

I'll just try and request they add the lib and be done with it.... Linux-fail!
So it is a remote X client then?

Linux-fail!
o_O! How does that POSSIBLY fail?!
How is that any different from using user level RDC (Citrix or MUC logmein type thing) on a 2k7 server and the admins refusing to install directX, flash or other dependency? If anything it is a PASS that it doesnt let you screw with it or run stuff they dont want you to.

personally i would do what taskmaster said, or tell them you will go with someone who can satisfy your client needs
(or just build your own server.. its free.. ex. hardware and powerbill, which 4tr is lower than 2k7 :).


nawi(Posted 2009) [#18]

I'll just try and request they add the lib and be done with it.... Linux-fail!

Sure, like I once tried to buy Carlsberg beer when I was underage but couldn't.. Carlsberg fail!!

Note: I actually didn't, that's fiction.


Canardian(Posted 2009) [#19]
Windows, Linux, MacOSX, OS/2, AIX, OS/400 and OpenVMS failed for me.
I'm trying now FreeBSD, which is supposed to run Windows and Linux apps faster than Windows and Linux itself!


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#20]
Lol fussy much? ;D

Trust me, if linux, wind and OSX failed, FBSD will fail more. It is actually a -really- good system but seems to be less supported than anything hardware wise - A real shame!.

(Unless it is for a server, then it is very good.:)


Canardian(Posted 2009) [#21]
At least FreeBSD runs on PowerPC, PC98, x86, amd64 (=x64), ia64, sparc64, and it used to run on MIPS too.

They just killed openSUSE with the 11.2 release as I can't run it on my PS3 and pSystem anymore, so I need to find a OS which supports my hardware.

I just checked that nVidia has also the newest 190.42 drivers for FreeBSD x86, so that won't be a problem either. I guess they don't have drivers for any PowerPC anyway, so it's not FreeBSD's fault.


DH(Posted 2009) [#22]
So it is a remote X client then?

It's a VPS

o_O! How does that POSSIBLY fail?!

Linux is always = fail (unless you have a few weeks of spare time to pour through newsgroups and forum posts to get what you need). Just because it suits your needs, doesn't mean it suits mine ;-)

If anything it is a PASS that it doesnt let you screw with it or run stuff they dont want you to.

The GNU C Library, commonly known as glibc, is the C standard library released by the GNU Project. Originally written by the Free Software ...

Pass indeed!

personally i would do what taskmaster said, or tell them you will go with someone who can satisfy your client needs

Probably what we will end up doing if they wont install it for us.

Sure, like I once tried to buy Carlsberg beer when I was underage but couldn't.. Carlsberg fail!!

How is that even similar? If Carlsberg made 50 different kinds of beer, only 1 of which could be injested by you, and 95% of your local pubs didn't stock that 1 kind, then sure, Carlsberg fail....

I'm not going to resurrect the whole "linux vs" debate.. Everyone knows the woes of working with anything opensource or community maintained. You have to mix and match everything, which at times gets to be a really annoying pain. One thing I give Apple and M$ is that they do try to keep things pretty straight forward and simple. Sure, call me simple, but when I spend more time on configurations than I do in actual development, there is a problem.

So what am I supposed to do? Ask BRL for a full list of all libraries required by Blitzmax (linux), go to 100 different hosting providers listing all these libraries asking that they have them? I'm fairly sure if I made a .net2.0 app, all I would need is .net2.0....

Linux isn't the fail, your right, the waste of time involved with linux is the fail.


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#23]
How is that even similar?
It is extremely similar you are blaming something that is doing it's job, following the rules setup by those who are in control of it (who dont want anyone messing with it)
- Its like blaming an off licence for being closed on a national holiday.

Distros are meant to be easy, not "linux", and when you know what you're doing with them they -are-, and you end up wasting -less- time. Plus you cannot compare a VPS linux to a "desktop linux" any more or less than you can compare MVS or Citrix to a local Windows installation.

As i tried to tell/help you above, if it was -your- PC then it would take < a minute to solve. But it isnt so that is that. Either change service or make your own server that does exactly what YOU want.

So what am I supposed to do? Ask BRL for a full list of all libraries required by Blitzmax (linux), go to 100 different hosting providers listing all these libraries asking that they have them? I'm fairly sure if I made a .net2.0 app, all I would need is .net2.0..
No they already made one, everything is -usually- available from apt without fuss, and no, if you made a .net app needing anything outside of .net2's own scope (not uncommon) then yes you would need those dlls.


DH(Posted 2009) [#24]
OMG, I have little time to sit here and carry on your pointless argument.... I appreciate the help I was given, and I ended by saying
I'll just try and request they add the lib and be done with it.... Linux-fail!


Which indicated I was going to talk with the leasing company. Apparently 'Linux-fail' offended you, and I'm sorry it does ("offending you" and "linux-failing").

I'm entitled to my opinion and linux has been nothing but a mortal pain for me ever since I jumped into it back in 1990's. Perhaps you guys are 1000x smarter than I am in linux, sure! Perhaps you have the time to waste doing the same thing I can do in windows in 10 min or less, sure. Regardless of how ambitious I feel on any given day I always forget why I hate linux until I have to dive back into it again. And just when I make headway something changes and I need to go back and start all over again (it's like having an old beat up car, no matter how many parts you replaced last month, a whole new set of parts will fail this month).

You don't like my opinion on your precious O/S then so be it. I'm not going to change your mind and your not going to change mine. Feel good in knowing your way around an O/S more than I because in a year or two from now it'll all be obsolete anyhow and Blitmax will require a library that isn't on those servers as well...

So honestly, unless you have a bit more pro-linux propaganda to shove at me (outside of the simple answer of "nope, cant get around it, need to talk to the admin" which has been repeated how many times now, including by myself before you participated) please let the thread die!


nawi(Posted 2009) [#25]
Dark Half, you do realize the point which has been made several times over? Linux may suck, but it's stupid to blame Linux when you should blame the company (or yourself for not choosing the right company).


Nice_But_Dim(Posted 2009) [#26]
Use Windows save the agro.

Be Well


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#27]
@Darkhalf, linuxpropawhat?? Stop putting words in my mouth. Just because I like ubuntu doesnt mean i "like linux". (All other distros i tried were sh*t and "untamed" linux is a disorganised mess)
I was not offended at all (why would i be offended?). I was simply pointing out the only thing failing is your admins, not the system.
If you were trying to do something similar with MVS and the admins would not install DirectX for you and you had said "Windows = Fail!" I would have said the EXACT same thing because MVS!="Windows".

At least FreeBSD runs on PowerPC, PC98, x86, amd64 (=x64), ia64, sparc64, and it used to run on MIPS too.
Lol true. I actually like FreeBSD, it is a real shame it lacks a wider range of HW support.


GaryV(Posted 2009) [#28]
Dark Half is the Fredo of Linux users ;)


GaryV(Posted 2009) [#29]
I should note, this thread was started in the wrong forum. It should be under General Help. :D


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#30]
Or linux discussion :D


Brucey(Posted 2009) [#31]
Anyone know how I can get around needing GLIBC_2.4 for Blitzmax on linux

Yep. The version of Linux BMK was built on is incompatible with the GLIBC version on the machine you are attempting to run it.
You might rebuild bmk for that particular version of GLIBC.

error while loading shared libraries: libGLU.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory

Build your apps with Framework and Imports. (which you should anyway, btw).
However, if you use MaxGUI, it has built-in dependency for OpenGL - in which case either 1) Don't use GUI, or 2) use a different GUI without this problem.


gosse(Posted 2009) [#32]
Alternate solution: write your server software in C++ ;)


DH(Posted 2009) [#33]
You might rebuild bmk for that particular version of GLIBC

Thanks for the tip!
Can you point me to a document that instructs me how to do that?

Build your apps with Framework and Imports. (which you should anyway, btw).

Yeah, been doing that, seems to help a few other issues, just not this one :-)

Dark Half is the Fredo of Linux users ;)

I dont know what that means.....

Alternate solution: write your server software in C++ ;)

I had toyed with this solution about 4 hours into troubleshooting heh. However I know what kinda time it will take to accomplish :-(

Use Windows save the agro.

Yeah, this is where it's looking as the leasing company says the kernal is prebuilt rpms that they wont change. They basically told us they wont help.

Linux may suck, but it's stupid to blame Linux when you should blame the company

I really don't care who should be blamed. MY point is that working with linux in most cases is a pain because there is usually something that doesn't go right... Don't like my opinion, your welcome to your own, just don't expect me to change mine because you say so.

I was not offended at all (why would i be offended?).

Pardon me.

(All other distros i tried were sh*t and "untamed" linux is a disorganised mess)

Thank you for making my opinion validated. The Satellite server isn't Ubuntu, which sux because of all the flavors I am rather fond of Ubuntu and Debian....


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#34]
NP and Yeah i prefer the debian/ubuntu side of things too. :)

For many distros its like having a really great engine, tuning it yourself and sticking it inside a shite car.
-Its still a shite car that crashes quick :D

Most problems are nothing to do with linux but rather the distro's mess. (With the exception of debian, ubuntu, google etc.. and one or two others who seem to be doing a great job with it and actually setting some followable standards)


nawi(Posted 2009) [#35]
I really don't care who should be blamed.

Well you clearly don't care about logic, rationality and making sense.

MY point is that working with linux in most cases is a pain because there is usually something that doesn't go right... Don't like my opinion, your welcome to your own, just don't expect me to change mine because you say so.

Even though I disagree, I never said that and that was not the issue at hand.

For distros, I prefer Arch. Takes a day or two to set up, but is bullet proof, easy to maintain, fast & light, and of course suits your needs completely.


DH(Posted 2009) [#36]
Apparently this is nothing new for me:
http://www.blitzmax.com/Community/posts.php?topic=64340#718135


D4NM4N(Posted 2009) [#37]
Lol thats a bad few days :D.
Why did you not just install LAMP and be done with it? It installs everything you need in one command and then you just edit a few files to tell it how you want it to run with things like ssl etc. As for lack of support on 3rd party scripts you cant really blame PHP (learn it and write your own :P)
As for SSL no idea what happened there.


GaryV(Posted 2009) [#38]
I dont know what that means.....
Buy yourself the Godfather trilogy on DVD or Bluray.


Andy(Posted 2009) [#39]
>Use Windows save the agro.

What is agro?

Ahhhhh... Peace and Calm has been restored to the Universe.


Canardian(Posted 2009) [#40]
Ok, I installed FreeBSD. It's quite nice, and I like the independant design of it, and with X Windows + KDE it looks just the same as any Linux with KDE.
It runs windows apps with decent speed, but needs some finetuning to support a broader variety of windows apps.

Then I tried Debian 5.0. It is amazing! It's much more professional than Ubuntu and Mint, and Ubuntu is a derivate of Debian, and Mint is a derivate of Ubuntu. It seems all they did in Ubuntu and Mint is just to bloat it, and bring more bugs and slowness into it. Debian raw is insanely fast, stable, and easy to use. There's no point to derive from it. Besides, Debian supports like 10 hardware systems, while Ubuntu and Mint supports only Intel.

So now my favorite OS is Debian, but I'm still giving FreeBSD or NetBSD a second look.

But what really amazed me about Debian, is that it runs Windows apps faster than Windows XP (which runs Windows apps faster than Vista and Win 7). No Linux wine has done that before. I got 301 FPS in WinXP, and 303 FPS in Debian for the same Leadwerks Engine 2.3 app.


Htbaa(Posted 2009) [#41]
@Dark Half: Get rid of your hosting company and take a Cloud server from Rackspacecloud.com. It's dead cheap and it's basically a Virtual Private Server which makes it that you have full control over the system. You can install whatever you like.


DH(Posted 2009) [#42]
Why did you not just install LAMP and be done with it?
Never heard of LAMP. Looks like it is only Apache 1.x?

Buy yourself the Godfather trilogy on DVD or Bluray.

Ahhh, good ole Godfather references in a programming forum. You couldn't geek that out a bit more? I suppose being the weakest linux user doesn't mean much as I've worked with many die hard linux users (older, less showered men who have no social life and tend to make typical conversation boring when they build up to "hey, lets trade aliases scripts sometime" in the first 4 min of talking...). So I take it as a compliment I guess :-)

@Dark Half: Get rid of your hosting company and take a Cloud server from Rackspacecloud.com. It's dead cheap and it's basically a Virtual Private Server which makes it that you have full control over the system. You can install whatever you like.

Actually that looks rather interesting. I'll give it a look! Thanks!


DH(Posted 2009) [#43]
Those rackcloud servers look like what we need. Thanks for the advice Htbaa!


xlsior(Posted 2009) [#44]
LAMP = Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP. Can by any version.


DH(Posted 2009) [#45]
Rackcloud are AMD 64 processors, I dont think Blitzmax will run on that will it?


DH(Posted 2009) [#46]
Got it working via the document here:
http://www.blitzbasic.com/Community/posts.php?topic=77778

Thanks again for all the help!


Htbaa(Posted 2009) [#47]
Good to hear!


xlsior(Posted 2009) [#48]
Rackcloud are AMD 64 processors, I don't think blitzmax will run on that will it?


I think they would -- aside from some instruction sets like MMX and such, both Intel and AMD implement the same x86 and x64 instructions in all their mainstream processors.

(Originally Intel developed their own 64 bit stuff, used in the itanium, that had no 32-bit backwards compatibility. AMD then released their x64 extensions so their CPUs could run both x86 and x64 at the same time, and beat the pants off of Intel with it since very few people were willing to give up the ability to run 32 bit code. Intel ended up licensing AMD's x64 exentions for use in the Core 2 (and others) CPU lines, essentially flushing a few billion dollars down the toilet that they spend on the itanium stuff.